A Christian (briefly) is someone who believes in the Lord Jesus Christ and who follows Him. Not many people do that although a lot of people when asked will say they are Christian without knowing what it means and I doubt many monarchs have been true Christians. Henry VIII for example killed his wives and set up the Anglican Church to rid himself of the Pope. If you asked him he would have said he was a Christian. If you were to ask God I think you will get a different answer.
This also is the answer to the Crusades which people say was Christian, but in reality they were foreign adventures and mercenaries who were out to plunder another country and were far from being Christian.
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http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=460047
Quote:
Originally Posted by quisquose
On every census we’ve been on, myself, my wife, our family and our friends have all been identified as "Christian" and yet all of us with a few exceptions are agnostic/atheists.
I predict that a significant number of us will actually be thinking about the question properly in the 2011 census, and ticking the "non-religious" box correctly because that is what we are, rather than the box of the religion that we think we are culturally attached to.
I expect some worried self analysis from the Archbishop and his friends as the number of "Christians" is shown to have fallen dramatically from 2001's 72%, even though in reality it was never that high anyway.
People rarely identify themselves are atheist, and most of us carry some sort of woo-woo beliefs or identify themselves as “spiritual” even if they don’t believe in a god. I actually know some atheists that believe in ghosts!
I have some Norwegian colleagues (there's one sat opposite me now) and have visited all the countries in Scandinavia often. I have never met anyone there for whom religion is important. So I thought your 17% claim was a little odd.
The link you provided asks just 3 interesting questions:
I believe there is a God - or - I believe there is some sort of spirit or life force - or -
I don’ t believe there is any sort of spirit, God or life force.
You quite deliberately claimed that the 17% of Norwegians that chose option 3 meant that there are only 17% that identify themselves as atheist. Since I have just asked my atheist wife the same questions as she has chosen option 2, the only thing we can say with certainty from your link is that the percentage of atheists in that country is somewhere between 17% and 68%.
If anything, my anecdotal experience is more reliable than your statistical ‘proof’, and the link you provided backs up essential’s assertion (say that after a couple of pints!) rather than yours, that there does appear to be a negative correlation between belief in god and societal health.
I have this book on order:
Society without God: What the Least Religious Nations Can Tell Us About Contentment by Phil Zuckerman
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Society-with...5129473&sr=8-1
As for Christian Aid, I would not suppose it needs explaining anymore than secular charities like Oxfam, Save the Children, the Red Cross, Medicin San Frontiers, Childline, Shelter, Mind and numerous others, large and small. These organisations are inspired by human altruism and compassion. Besides, I would never claim religion cannot be a motivation for good, but just because religion might motivate charitable work does NOT mean that they benefit society overall. The empirical evidence from Zuckerman and other studies backs this up.
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Reply.
I am so glad you said that because it sounds like an honest post straight from the heart and probably every atheist would echo your thoughts. And you know what, if you were to have taken a census of people down the ages you would have had similar results only some people would have been making stone circles, worshiping sun gods and making human sacrifice which last time I looked is still happening. People in general are not Christians and when you talk about large numbers of people, whether it is a football crowd, a pop concert, or an army going into battle you will find the biggest number of people are like yourself, atheists.
So next time anyone talks about the crusades or the war in Iraq, please remember it is mainly atheists you are pointing the finger at, and please don’t lay the blame for the sins of the world at the feet of Christians, because as you have stated, there aren’t very many.
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